Our Industry Needs The Elimination Of The Paper Dollar Bill

[MrMachine]

James, if you do an informal survey of regular people who are not your customers, I think you will find that many people will favor one particular payment method when they do their laundry.

In the interest of avoiding another online brawl, I will not post the results of my personal informal survey as yours could be different.

Ask your friends which payment method THEY prefer.

[Adamski]

Originally Posted by silver56

... Yet are we all really focused on the means of growing the self-service laundry industry or simply focused on seeing the industry grow, period?

Let us not lose sight of the overall mission!

Robert,

You brought us back to my original post. My comments had nothing to do with general public opinion or even Congressional opinion. My comments had everything to do with steering this industry in a direction that best serves our current and future customers. Without customers, this industry ceases to exist. Coin and card operators have agreed over and over again that what works in one market may not work as well in another market. With that in mind, my comments have fully supported the continuation of both coin and card stores.

My original comments can be summarized by the following 6 points:

1. 95% of laundromats have chosen coin vend systems. There is no indication that this ratio will change anytime soon.
2. With the quarter becoming less viable, the dollar coin is the only substitute coin available to operators of coin vend systems.
3. This industry should favor the phase out of the dollar bill to support the needed dollar coin.
4. Individual operators will still be able to use any existing or newly developed vend system of their choice (quarters, dollar coins, CCI card, Easy Card, Wash Card, Spyder Wash, ESD Card, etc).
5. Elimination of the dollar bill will have a minimal adverse effect on existing laundromats.
6. Supporting our coin vend systems will allow card laundromats to remain unique. It will also help keep card systems and components competatively priced since operators will always have the option of reverting to a coin vend system if card system costs begin to sky-rocket.

[Howard]

Originally Posted by Adamski

......

3. This industry should favor the phase out of the dollar bill to support the needed dollar coin.

5. Elimination of the dollar bill will have a minimal adverse effect on existing laundromats.

I won't even bother with the other points, as we have addressed them. These two above (#3 and #5) are just plain WRONG!!!!

The vast majority of the laundry industry uses the dollar bill, I would venture to say this is 99.5%+ of all stores. I would venture to say that even your store uses a dollar bill in its change machines. Thus, no laundromat should favor the elimination of the dollar bill as it will cause operational problems.

Elimination of the dollar bill in favor of the dollar coin will have huge cost impacts on almost every single laundromat, especially if you are going to force them to go to a dollar coin. First it will cause major problems for customers that want to use a store that is based on quarters or card systems as the smallest bills they can then use will be the $5 bill. So, operators will either have to purchase a new device to convert dollar coins to quarters or card value, or they will have to force their customers to deal with lots of extra coins (changing $5 bills to quarters when they only need three quarters) or for card stores forcing people to add a minimum of $5 at a shot.

Further, converting to dollar coins will force owners to install all new coin drops and incur huge costs for them.

Larry, just stop this silly push that this is what is best for the industry. This is what is best for you. Explain that, and stop it. Stop trying to advocate something that will hurt the vast majority of laundry owners, not to mention the vast majority of any business that use the dollar bill.

[Adamski]

Originally Posted by Howard

... Elimination of the dollar bill in favor of the dollar coin will have huge cost impacts on almost every single laundromat, especially if you are going to force them to go to a dollar coin. First it will cause major problems for customers that want to use a store that is based on quarters or card systems as the smallest bills they can then use will be the $5 bill. So, operators will either have to purchase a new device to convert dollar coins to quarters or card value, or they will have to force their customers to deal with lots of extra coins (changing $5 bills to quarters when they only need three quarters) or for card stores forcing people to add a minimum of $5 at a shot.

Howard,

I did not say that elimination of the dollar bill will have NO adverse impact on existing laundromats. Please try to read my posts as carefully as I try to write them. If I and others have to install dollar coin accepter kits on our bill changers and VTMs, that is a minimal impact considering our money system would be making a move from a paper dollar to a dollar coin.

Once the kits are installed, coin and card stores would continue to operate normally.

Further, converting to dollar coins will force owners to install all new coin drops and incur huge costs for them.

Again, please read more carefully. I did not advocate for forcing any owner to install "all new coin drops". Each owner will evaluate the available options and make his own choice. If an owner wants to stay on QO until the turn of the century; that's his choice.

... just stop this silly push that this is what is best for the industry. This is what is best for you. Explain that, and stop it. Stop trying to advocate something that will hurt the vast majority of laundry owners ...

You really need to read my post again. I'm not pushing anyone toward any particular vend system. I'm merely saying that an industry-wide stand in favor of phasing out the dollar bill will ensure that all vend system options remain available to all owners. That will ensure competition among the various vend systems. Such competition could save store owners real money as they evaluate system costs during their individual quest for a system to replace QO. Phasing out the dollar bill is a reasonable step and now is the right time.

[Howard]

I stand by what I said, phasing out the paper dollar will have a large cost impact on 99.5%+ of all laundromat owners. You just don't get it that for you to use a dollar coin does not mean that the rest of the world has to give up the paper money that they prefer. Just drop it, use the coin that you like but stop trying to tell everyone that they need to support your idea to kill the dollar bill.

It is against the best interest of the vast majority of operators to want to eliminate the dollar bill - it is something that will cost them money and provide them with no value.

[Adamski]

Originally Posted by Howard

I stand by what I said, phasing out the paper dollar will have a large cost impact on 99.5%+ of all laundromat owners. You just don't get it that for you to use a dollar coin does not mean that the rest of the world has to give up the paper money that they prefer. Just drop it, use the coin that you like but stop trying to tell everyone that they need to support your idea to kill the dollar bill.

It is against the best interest of the vast majority of operators to want to eliminate the dollar bill - it is something that will cost them money and provide them with no value.

Howard,

Let's get one thing straight. I have not and will not require the elimination of the dollar bill to maintain my DCO system.

There are, however, plenty of good reasons for the 4 year phase out of the dollar bill. The elimination of the dollar bill will reduce bill accepter maintenance in all laundromats by 50-75 percent. Substituting the dollar coin for the dollar bill will greatly reduce the time it takes a customer to put a dollar's value on her wash card or get 4 quarters change. The elimination of the dollar bill benefits everyone, owner and customer alike. I have not heard a single, logical reason why this industry should stand against the 4 year phase out of the dollar bill. To do so would be ILLOGICAL.

[CanCanCase]

Originally Posted by MrMachine

James, if you do an informal survey of regular people who are not your customers, I think you will find that many people will favor one particular payment method when they do their laundry.

In the interest of avoiding another online brawl, I will not post the results of my personal informal survey as yours could be different.

Ask your friends which payment method THEY prefer.

Paul-
Interesting you mention some non-customer informal polling, as that's EXACTLY what I did before I bought my first store. It's also what I did just before taking possession of #2.

Back in 2009, the 'mat market in this town featured 5 dumpy quarter stores, 1 aged quarter store, and one small new card store. Having just spent a week on a Carnival cruise ship, I was marveling at the marketing potential of a card system, but I was also undecided about the particular system we were going to use in our first store. I talked to people all over town, in each laundromat, and even well outside the laundromat businesses (side note: did you know WalMart managers are trained to approach anyone conducting informal "surveys" in their stores and give them a boilerplate cease and desist order right there in the hardware aisle of the store?)

I also conducted similar polling when we were negotiating the purchase of #2. At the time, it was the only 24-hour laundromat in 5 counties, and I was curious to see whether copying our setup from #1 would be a good move or if I should leave things alone with the coins.

Both of those surveys - yes, completely informal and unscientific...they probably were skewed toward my card technology bias too! - had 2 responses which formed the overwhelming majority upon which I based my decision. First was "I'm not comfortable dragging a bunch of quarters in to do my wash late at night. I wish someone would use credit cards for a laundromat here." That's the safety issue.... a good many of my late night customers are in during the daytime to pre-load their card's balance so they don't need any money (especially bulky coins) with them when they return to wash at 3:00 am. Then there was the "I hate all these quarters! You've got to jam 18 of them in the slot to start that washer over there." When pressed with "what about dollar coins?" those responses always earned a "I hate those things. It's still a heavy coin. I like paper money."

Just more proof that each market varies and what works for one store may well doom another to failure. Personally, I've tried to use and like dollar coins, but various stores' inability to deal with them has left a bad feeling with me as a consumer. I am currently working a deal to buy a 4th store right now... it currently runs on quarters, and if I decide to run it as-is for any period of time before converting it to card, rest assured I'll be making the change to DC/Q as soon as I possibly can to alleviate the over-full coin box issue that the store sees every weekend.

Originally Posted by Adamski

...Each owner will evaluate the available options and make his own choice. If an owner wants to stay on QO until the turn of the century; that's his choice....

...I'm merely saying that an industry-wide stand in favor of phasing out the dollar bill will ensure that all vend system options remain available to all owners....

Larry- Your arguments are all very well thought-out and obviously based on a great deal of experience and experimenting. For that, I thank you. You and I have been able to agree that each market is different and what works well for me might not be a good choice in your area - and vice versa.

Where I'm seeing the most disagreement, however, is in your assertion that eliminating the paper $1 will preserve ALL options for all owners. Choice, options and flexibility are some of the most valuable "tools" a small business owner has to compete with. Phasing out the $1 bill will certainly increase the popularity and viability of the dollar coin, but it would also eliminate FOUR OPTIONS for a customer. Yes...FOUR. Right now, in both your store and mine, a customer can choose to exchange $1, $2, $3 or $4 worth of paper for an equivalent amount of goods, services, or other form of currency. Now if we eliminate the dollar bill, that same customer will have the same choices in your store, but will be limited to a minimum of $5 in my stores. Coming from the restaurant business, I'm all for increasing a minimum transaction amount or "ticket average." But the point is, an option is eliminated.

-Case

[Adamski]

Originally Posted by CanCanCase

... Where I'm seeing the most disagreement, however, is in your assertion that eliminating the paper $1 will preserve ALL options for all owners... (phasing out the dollar bill) would also eliminate FOUR OPTIONS for a customer. Yes...FOUR. Right now, in both your store and mine, a customer can choose to exchange $1, $2, $3 or $4 worth of paper for an equivalent amount of goods, services, or other form of currency. Now if we eliminate the dollar bill, that same customer will have the same choices in your store, but will be limited to a minimum of $5 in my stores. Coming from the restaurant business, I'm all for increasing a minimum transaction amount or "ticket average." But the point is, an option is eliminated.

Case,

With the addition of a dollar coin accepter on your VTMs, your customers would have the 4 options of putting $1, $2, $3 or $4 onto her wash card. She would be just as likely to have dollar coins in her purse then as she is likely to have dollar bills in her purse today. So, with the phase out of the dollar bill and the addition of simple dollar coin accepters on your VTMs; your customers are just as well served in the future as they are now. Actually, they're better served because they can stick dollar coins into a coin accepter a whole lot faster than they can feed a dollar bill into a bill validator today. Clink ... clink ... clink ... clink - $4 credit put on the wash card.

[CanCanCase]

Originally Posted by Adamski

Case,

With the addition of a dollar coin accepter on your VTMs, your customers would have the 4 options of putting $1, $2, $3 or $4 onto her wash card. She would be just as likely to have dollar coins in her purse then as she is likely to have dollar bills in her purse today. So, with the phase out of the dollar bill and the addition of simple dollar coin accepters on your VTMs; your customers are just as well served in the future as they are now. Actually, they're better served because they can stick dollar coins into a coin accepter a whole lot faster than they can feed a dollar bill into a bill validator today. Clink ... clink ... clink ... clink - $4 credit put on the wash card.

You're forgetting one step in the process... whether Ms. Customer is in your DCO store, one of my card stores, or my quarter store one of the first things she probably does is go to the "change machine"... At your store, she validates a $20, and gets 20 coins. At my quarter store, she validates a $20 and gets 80 coins (or 35 coins if I've got a fancy dual-pay coin changer, but that's new-fangled high-technology!) At my card stores, she validates a $20 and gets 8 bills. Now, if you take away the $1 bill, the ONLY way I can give my customers the choice of adding value to their card in $1 increments is to buy a whole new pair of changers that dispense dollar coins and fives AND add the dollar coin acceptor functionality to one or more VTMs....PER LOCATION.

Again, I'll admit it's a soft argument since I'm fundamentally in favor of increasing Ms. Customer's cash-in (float) but the fact remains, eliminating a one dollar note REDUCES my options for doing business. Eliminating a one dollar note REDUCES my customers' options for paying conveniently. Here's the kicker: eliminating a one dollar note DOES NOT INCREASE your options in your chosen business environment. Eliminating a one dollar note DOES NOT INCREASE your customers' payment options.

If we can agree that a small biz owner will be most successful when he or she has the most flexibility and options available to them, then I fail to see why someone who already has the dollar coin option fully available and implemented would push to reduce options. I guess I could understand the lobbying if your goal was to cripple a competitor, but most of us here seem to want to take the "high road" and compete based on POSITIVES rather than negatives, yes?

-Case

[CanCanCase]

...and another thing:
You've streamlined your operation and collection activities based on handling a volume of coins. I've streamlined my activities based on handling a stack of bills. Both coins and bills have "bad points" to their handling which slows us down. Now you're asking me to take on the bad handling characteristics of BOTH methods. To collect, count and deposit efficiently, I have to sort paper notes, face bills, (optionally band them), recycle as many as I can back into the ATM and B2B changer, then take the remaining stack of bills to the bank for deposit. Why on earth would I WANT to do all of that with the paper money AND THEN dump coin boxes into bags, count or weigh coins, (optionally roll them), recycle as many as you can back into the changers, then take the remaining sacks or rolls to the bank for deposit.

Once again, you've chosen to use dollar coins. Great! They work well in your market and for your customers. I have the option of using dollar coins, and that option is great! Phasing out the dollar bill won't do anything to hurt your chosen method of doing business, but it WILL create extra expense, work and "harm" to over 60% of the laundromats in my market.

-Case